[UK] Offer for Car Servicing alongside MOT

All Honda E related discussions
RCH
Posts: 26
Joined: Wed May 19, 2021 11:54 am

Post by RCH »

Hi community.

My wife has a 2021 Advanced model and it’s coming up for an MOT inspection. The Honda service centre at Brayley’s in Enfield asked if she wanted “car servicing” alongside the inspection.

I called the centre to inquire what that entailed and the response was a “full health check, brake fluid change and software updates if required” for £275 (not sure if that includes VAT). Note that the agent didn’t exactly know what was checked, and an air filter replacement is not included.

For those that have experienced this, is the servicing something that is worthwhile doing? Thanks in advance!

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EEEE
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Joined: Mon Aug 16, 2021 10:33 am

Post by EEEE »

Each honda garage will offer their own 'servicing packages'.

Regardless, I believe all (most?) UK purchased e's came with 5 years free servicing included? I did not by my e brand new (4 month old demonstrator). I asked my preferred dealer (different franchise) if it had a service plan registered against it, and they said it did, and my last service, and next service (and the 2 after that) will be free.

The service consists of brake fluid change and probably cabin air filter element change. I believe at 5 years / 60k miles the diff housing / gear case oil is changed.

Changing the brake fluid is very much worth doing, paying £275 for it probably isn't good value for money if you ask me.
'21 e Advance - Charge Yellow - E1702RR alloys
'17 Civic Sport CVT
'00 Prelude 2.2VTi
MattHero
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Joined: Fri Aug 21, 2020 2:17 pm

Post by MattHero »

There is a scheduled service order for the e that dealers should be adhering to thought right?

I didn't take the service package when I got mine from new, but when I book in annually, there's a slightly different fixed fee for the scheduled service type, which now I'm over the 3 year mark has the MOT on top. I'm booked in for August already for the 4 year MOT and scheduled service and I think it's just over £200. £275 for an non-specific health check seems a touch high to me.
2020 Advance Charge Yellow on 16s.
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londiniumperson
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Post by londiniumperson »

My personal experience of UK Honda dealers is well below what anyone could ever consider normal, but here was the quoted costs for the 1st MOT and service:
MOT: £54.85
Service: £335.00
Brake fluid change: £92.00

The service was just labour because there are no parts replaced at this interval. Also they couldn't tell me what they would do beforehand or provide a service sheet afterwards detailing what they had done.
Then there was charge to look at the window fault again which I've had since almost new at £180.00
2020 Advance in Crystal Black Pearl on 17's - 08/2020-Current
2015 VW Tiguan (Pure White) - 04/2018-Current
1991 Honda Beat PP1 (Festival Red) - 11/2022-Current
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EEEE
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Post by EEEE »

I took mine in for its annual service (as part of the 5 free offered with the car), and was advised it needed an aircon re-gas service. I know dealers need to make a little bit of money so I agreed knowing full well it wasn't required (it's not like they have any exciting new models coming up to sell me lol, I doubt even the prelude, should it come out, will be exciting), but they did leave me with 3 faults logged regarding the AC system - cleared them myself when I got home.

There is no such thing as a Honda dealership - they are all individual franchises (some of which run various marques in the same area), reselling various finance and insurances and miscellaneous services. This means that when you phone up for a 'service' , you will never get the same thing offered or costed, everywhere will be different.
'21 e Advance - Charge Yellow - E1702RR alloys
'17 Civic Sport CVT
'00 Prelude 2.2VTi
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londiniumperson
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Post by londiniumperson »

EEEE wrote: Tue May 21, 2024 10:26 am ...
This means that when you phone up for a 'service' , you will never get the same thing offered or costed, everywhere will be different.
Either this is not correct or the Portsmouth Hendy Honda dealership are blatant liars, the reason being is because I have previously questioned the service costs and was told by the service manager that they had expressly been told by Honda UK that they are not to negotiate on servicing prices.

I think I know the answer to whether you are correct or whether staff at the Portsmouth Hendy Honda dealership are liars.
2020 Advance in Crystal Black Pearl on 17's - 08/2020-Current
2015 VW Tiguan (Pure White) - 04/2018-Current
1991 Honda Beat PP1 (Festival Red) - 11/2022-Current
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EEEE
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Post by EEEE »

I guess the problem is that servicing can mean different things to different customers and dealers. That variation in expectation/interpretation leads to the mess we all experience dealing with dealers. There is no one price / one service menu as much as we are lead to believe. If there was, I guess it would be printed out in black and white at the point of sale.

If Aylesbury Honda suggest my car needs an aircon gas recharge after 3 years, then surely that comes from Honda above, and thus should be part of the 5 years of free servicing? I'm fairly sure there is no test they performed to check the AC gas weight or efficacy of the system (it worked perfectly fine), I know they can measure the gas by weight if they suck it out, but then they've done all the work required to replace it lol. If it's advised from their own determination based on experience, then I guess some dealers are either better/more knowledgeable than others, or simply looking to make more upsell opportunities convert. My guess is the latter.

Like I say, dealers will simply look for perfect price promotion and upsell opportunities, at the cost of transparency to the customer. I'm not too fussed that I spent £85 for gas replacement that almost certainly wasn't needed, but slightly miffed that they didn't clear the codes relating to the compressor electronics that were disconnected to perform the task. I know that 10th gen civic AC compressors are prone to failure, but they were covered by recall in the US at least, probably manufacturing related, and parts probably a different source for US vs UK produced vehicles. I don't believe the 10th gen ever had AC re-gas advised when we took it to the same place for paid for servicing (it had a 3 year dealer service plan purchased alongside the vehicle at the time of purchase).

Having a quick chat at the service desk, they did mention the extended warranty available. I mentioned door handles weren't covered, but they did reassure me that the brake booster issue is covered (Having already done a new CRV , but no Jazz or E yet). The cost of the 3 year warranty was close to £900 I recall, so I think I'll take my chances on that one, id like to think I'm less than 33% likely to have the issue, so on balance its not worth it if you play it by numbers.

I guess car dealerships are stuck in the past (I don't even get the video of the walkaround under the car as you might expect), some consumers are more informed and knowledgeable now - they want details, they want specifics, they want to compare. They want choice and value for money. I dropped the car off at a small dealership, came back 4 hours later and who knows what was really done or to what extent? I got a sheet saying everything was checked and 'green' , but didn't see an invoice or part number for cabin air filter or brake fluid. Do they follow the manufacturer schedule exactly? Make up their own schedule? Blend of the 2? Who knows. Do they really do a full flush of the brake fluid, or just a hundred ml at each corner to prevent breaking into that 2nd bottle of brake fluid? Do they just do it manually or use the dealer tool to run the ABS/VSA pumps and solenoids/valves (which I suspect is listed in the official process). Who knows... I don't know what is in it for the dealer, I guess they can claim maybe an hours labour time at cost from Honda head office for inspection and brake fluid change, so its not surprising they try the upsells. Its down to the dealer to convert the customer into a profitable customer over the lifetime of the customer relationship (upsells/warranties/convenience priced consumables/extra services/etc).

I guess I'm just getting old and cynical now I've turned 40.
'21 e Advance - Charge Yellow - E1702RR alloys
'17 Civic Sport CVT
'00 Prelude 2.2VTi
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londiniumperson
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Post by londiniumperson »

I don't see how servicing can mean different things to different customers and dealers, a can manufacture documents exactly what they expect a mechanic to do at each specified mileage & age of vehicle.

Official dealership repair and servicing technicians receive comprehensive instructions, complete with step-by-step guides and visual aids. However, whether they adhere to these guidelines correctly or take shortcuts ultimately depends on their ethical conduct.

Certain items, such as brake fluid replacement will only appear on invoices during the third-year service (then on I believe it is every 2 years), while cabin pollen filters come into play during the second year and then every two years thereafter.
2020 Advance in Crystal Black Pearl on 17's - 08/2020-Current
2015 VW Tiguan (Pure White) - 04/2018-Current
1991 Honda Beat PP1 (Festival Red) - 11/2022-Current
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EEEE
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Post by EEEE »

It's not even that clear what service schedule to run. The owners manual states:

"If your vehicle comes with the service book, the maintenance schedule for your
vehicle is available in the book." (Page 587).

That 'Service and Warranty' book lists the type of inspections and what to replace, but doesn't actually list a schedule. It says the schedule will show on the vehicles driver information interface. I am familiar with this on the 10th gen civic, it often tells me it needs an A service (oil and filter) and then occasionally AB2 or similar which is A + gearbox CVT oil + inspection. You can clear all but the inspection with the infotainment interface. The civic will warn me 30 days in advance that a service is due. It seems to like me changing the oil pretty much every 8k/miles or every 6months.

I do not believe the E has the variable service reminder system set / turned on (as others have reported, there is no option on the scroll wheel of icons) - so technically, it is never to be serviced? I also note that the PDI section of my booklet has not been completed (Mine was a 4 month old demonstrator when I bought it, complete with chassis bungs in the glove box).

If I follow the schedule in the owners manual on page 588, then the pollen filter wants doing every year, and brake fluid every 3.

According to the service booklet - a B service is just an inspection, no pollen (code 2) , no transmission fluid (code 3) and no brake fluid change (code 7).

One excellent document I do have is a list entitled Honda ECU Reprogramming. It lists my VIN and mileage and the date checked, then a list of all modules and any updates performed.

One was updated:

EV/HEV/IMA Battery, Program ID 1K101-61M-E040 upgraded to 1K101-61M-E050.

All other modules are up to date at this time:

EV/HEV/IMA motor 1K021-61M-E030
Management ECU 1K201-61M-E130
SHIFTER 54008-TYF-E010
Battery Charge Control Module 1K301-61M-E020
EV/HEV/IMA Battery 2 1K111-061M-E040
DCT-TDU 24851-5WR-A010
ABS/VSA 57114-TYF-E030
ESB 46114-TYF-E020
EPS 39990-TYF-N030
SRS 77959-TYF-E430
Meter 78108-TYF-E620
METER Display 78108-TYF-E620
ACC/CMBS 36802-TYF-E050
CAMERA 36161-TYF-E020
MVCAPS 36505-TYF-E150
Parking Sensor 39673-TYF-J130
PLC 1K491-61M-E010
AVAS 37419-TYF-E010
Battery Charger 1C601-61M-E010
CanGW Internal 38898-TYF-E140
CAN-Gateway 38897-TYF-E140
BCM 38808-TYF-E010

I seem to recall you can check these numbers in the 'secret menu' - the above listing is for a UK market car - other part numbers for vary markets firmware may differ or not receive the same updates, so I guess its only valid for a UK car (manufactured year L=2020 in the vin)
'21 e Advance - Charge Yellow - E1702RR alloys
'17 Civic Sport CVT
'00 Prelude 2.2VTi
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londiniumperson
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Post by londiniumperson »

The service reminder system can be set by the dealer, mine was on from new and was inaccurate, alerting me nearly two months early, instead of the intended 30 days before service. This is because the dealer either:
- Didn't correctly set the initial PDI date when the car arrived (during PDI, pre-delivery inspection).
- Misrepresented the car's arrival date and lied to me.
Again you can decide whether it was bad ethical standards or genuine mistake by an incompetent employee.
When I inquired about resetting the date, I was surprised to learn it's locked in Honda's system at PDI. The only option was to disable the reminder entirely, which I opted for.

As for the documented servicing in the handbook, which will have been written a long time before cars need servicing, I can understand that this might be modified by the manufacturer, therefore the handbook will only be a guideline.

Did the servicing dealer provide the 'Honda ECU Reprogramming' list at each service, because mine denied anything like that was available?
2020 Advance in Crystal Black Pearl on 17's - 08/2020-Current
2015 VW Tiguan (Pure White) - 04/2018-Current
1991 Honda Beat PP1 (Festival Red) - 11/2022-Current
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